Mark Fasken: All right. So Danielle, today we're going to be talking about the art of shareholder communication and how you can tailor your communication strategy when speaking to different investor types. 

Challenges in the Energy Sector

Mark Fasken: Now, you operate in the energy sector. It's a pretty technical sector. There's a lot of different KPIs and there's a lot about the supply chain. It's pretty complicated. Shell is obviously a very large company with a lot of different aspects. Given these challenges, how do you approach explaining some of these technical intricacies to investors without overwhelming them?

Danielle Collins: Yeah. So thanks so much for having me.

Thanks for the question. Let me start by saying that I appreciate each industry, whether it be energy, tech, health care, consumer goods, or the list goes on. Each industry will have its own set of challenges when communicating with investors. We are here to talk about energy specifically, but hopefully, some of the things I talk about today will also resonate more broadly. 

For energy, basically, the landscape is so incredibly diverse. As you know, Mark, energy companies can range from pure play, so for example, you're an EMP company or an LNG company to those that are really diverse, like the company that I work at, with lots of different types of businesses, and portfolios. Anywhere from chemicals, refining, upstream oil and gas, LNG, biofuels, retail, lubricants, and power.

I mean, the list can go on and on. 

Simplifying Complex Information

Danielle Collins: And this diversity really requires analysts when choosing what energy stocks they want to ultimately own, to have to grasp not only complexities of each business but also as you noted the distinct operational models, when they're deciding to say, Hey, I want to own Company A versus Company B, so this really means a communication strategy that keeps it simple, right?

So you've really got to simplify that complexity into really digestible pieces, and I will say that this simplification in the energy sector is becoming increasingly more important, specifically as we see a decrease, unfortunately, in the number of energy specialists and an increase in generalists, which we welcome the generalist into the stock. But also you see this happening in step with the decrease in energy sector representation in the S&P 500. 

So just to give some context about what we're actually seeing in the market, and the importance of tailoring your communication strategy, specifically as we've seen a growth in more generalists entering the stock.

A few years ago, I was at the Citi conference in Boston, and I ran into one of my long-only generalist investors, whom I'd seen earlier that day. They were in the elevator, going all the way down to the bottom. And I said, "Oh, you know, thanks for the meeting earlier. Really great questions. Are you done for the day? Are you heading home, heading back to the office?"

And they said, "Oh no, I'm actually headed to a second conference." And I said, "Oh, well, what kind of conference?" And they're like, "Oh, on the spirits industry." So I was like, the spirits. Oh, okay, so alcoholic beverages. And the reason I share that story is because I think a lot of us think about generalists as covering related sectors. But this interaction really underscores an important reminder for myself, an important reminder for IR teams and CEOs and CFOs, that the majority of the PMs and analysts that you are meeting with who own or who are considering ownership of your stock cover vastly different sectors.

This is really important to note because this major communication strategy has to bridge the knowledge gaps, making complex topics accessible for analysts who switch between industries that, quite frankly, have little to nothing in common. I mean, I can't think of what alcoholic beverages have in common with energy, but yet this particular generalist has to understand both.

And I'll also point out that it's not just for the generalists that we need to simplify energy, but we also need to simplify energy for energy analysts themselves. And they'll tell you the same, they'll say, "Hey, I'm trying to cover a company, or companies that cover upstream on the one hand, and then the power business on another hand". And those are fundamentally really different businesses from an operational perspective, how they generate cash flows.

And you really need to bring it down to a basic level for simplification to make it easy. 

Tailoring Communication Strategies

Danielle Collins: So how do you achieve this? Really, you've got to focus on what's important to your investors. And look, that sounds super obvious. You know, I'm not giving away any secret sauce here, but in practice, it's actually really often overlooked.

Too often, when I look at press releases or Capital Market Day presentations, I notice that they try to address the concerns of multiple stakeholders. So, they'll try to address the concerns of NGOs, government, and company staff expectations, all alongside trying to address the concerns of investors.

As a result, the investor message often gets diluted. When companies try to tackle every stakeholder's concerns within investor communications, they risk losing focus on what truly matters to investors. So, I always advocate for addressing these other stakeholder concerns via separate channels or tailored content.

For example, recently, and this is a perfect example of when you lose the forest for the trees, I reviewed the investor materials from a pure play company, and they're not a peer of ours, but they are pure play company that I was just interested in taking a peek at their capital markets day materials.

I'm secretly jealous of this company's investor relations because I thought, wow, this is going to be a really easy story to communicate. They're in one business, and it's a relatively simple business model. So I went into their investor day presentation, and there were over 120 slides. That is a lot of slides for a business that I thought was pretty simple.

My view is that you ultimately bury the key investor message. For me, it really left no lasting impression, and I walked away with the question, well, what would be important to the investor to be able to make a fundamental decision to either grow or own this stock? So that's why I say it's pretty essential to prioritize and emphasize your core messages for your investors, to ensure clarity on impact, and also just focus on the information investors value most.

Mark, I don't know if you've read Gary Keller's book, The One Thing, 

Mark Fasken: Yes, I have actually. 

Danielle Collins: Okay. So it's not an industry book, as you know. I highly recommend it. So the core of the book is, basically 80 percent of your results come from 20 percent of your efforts. And I actually read this book out of interest before I started my investor relations career.

So I always reflect upon this one thing, right? And really, how I apply it to the investor relations profession. As I say, if I apply Gary's basic principles to investor communications, what it really means for me is focusing on the core assets and revenue-driving segments in a clear, straightforward way.

That means avoiding cluttering the investor story with details and businesses that don't really materially contribute to the bottom line, or provide any interesting value to shareholders. And so that's really how I look at investor communications and how to simplify things. 

Mark Fasken: That's super helpful.

And so, just putting that even further into context, like when you think about Shell as an example, I mean, you just mentioned there are many business units, there's all these different pieces of information that you could share with an investor. 

I'm sure with a generalist, you could spend hours just explaining the energy industry and the different players, and what Shell does, but it sounds like really what you try to bring that back to is just, is it really comes back to fundamental metrics, bringing it back to the financial metrics that they care about.

And really starting with that. And if they want to get into the details, leaving that for later. 

Danielle Collins: And indeed it's focusing on the things that you know, is most important to your investors, in terms of how they're going to evaluate your company, because look, the energy businesses can be super technical and there are some individuals that you'll meet with that'll be interested in learning about how you drill a deep water well, and how you're using AI, and how the technology works, but most times, they can't delve into that level of interest, because their portfolio is so broad and time is of the essence. And so we often have to remember we're busy as a company, but these investors are also incredibly busy with diverse portfolios and trying to manage everything 

Mark Fasken: Absolutely.

Absolutely. Okay. And so, the next layer of this, though, is that you now simplified your strategy, and I've had a conversation with a few other IROs, specifically in the healthcare sector and pharmaceutical space. I know that this is really challenging because you've got really, really deep science that you could explain.

But there are a lot of generalist investors that they'll never understand the science, right? And so that you then have to create this message that is really built around the opportunity, and really, what is the revenue opportunity of this business, and not so much about the science. So you break that out into here's my specialist pitch, where I can go into all that nitty gritty detail.

And here's my generalist pitch that's a little bit more high level. But then what about different investor types? Right. So you're going to have, you know, investors that are in there for the dividend, investors that are in there for growth, maybe a special situation, obviously, depending on where you are in the company life cycle, but, you know, for a company like Shell, you have such a broad range of investor types.

How do you tailor the communication strategy for each of those different types of investors? Do you build out personas and communication plans for each one? Or is it relatively consistent across all of them? 

Danielle Collins: So what is consistent, right, is the core messages must be the same. So your strategy is your strategy, but your communication style should be adaptable, and really you have to be what I call an IR chameleon.

So what this means for me is that you tailor your communication approach based on each investor's engagement style and specific areas of concern. I appreciate that that sounds super daunting, but to do it effectively, you really need to invest the time in understanding your investors' priorities, areas, and concerns. It's really a listening skill.

You've got to listen to their feedback. 

Mark Fasken: And so I like that term of being a chameleon and adapting your style to each investor. I mean, I've got a couple of questions on it, but one would be, can you give us an example of how you've done that? How you've adjusted your communication for a different set of investors?

Importance of Note-Taking and Preparation

Danielle Collins: So, it actually starts with consistently taking detailed notes in each engagement, I know that doesn't sound very sexy or exciting, and it isn't, but thorough notes are actually the foundation for successful future meetings.

Every time we have a meeting, if it's an IR-only meeting, we have at least two IROs, and both of them are actively using a shared OneNote to take notes. As one is talking, the other is taking notes, and vice versa. And anytime we have any C member on the road, of course, there's an investor relations professional that accompanies them. 

Of course, there are many ways to approach taking good notes. Again, it's super boring and basic, but it's important. We have a note-taking template to ensure consistency, and consistency helps in analysis post. So, in each and every meeting, we'll record the investors' questions, areas of interest, concerns, and feedback. We'll also include a section we call IR takeaway. Those are the specific points we need to consider for the next engagement with that investor. 

Danielle Collins: And so then before each and every new meeting, we review this historical information, and then we tailor our approach, right? 

The IR chameleon. 

For instance, if investor A has met with us multiple times and consistently raises concerns about LNG oversupply or the pace of the energy transition, we would make it a priority to address these topics in the meeting to align with their specific interests.

If, for some reason, we continue to meet with them and have not been able to address their concerns, then if we hadn't done so already, we would actually look to pair that particular investor with a senior leader who runs a business where they might have an area of particular interest or concern.

Danielle Collins: The other thing that I would add with this, and tailoring your meetings, you also want your meetings to be memorable. So go back to what we said earlier, whether it be sector analysts or generalist portfolio managers, analysts meet with a lot of companies. So it's really essential to stand out.

While your financials and strategy will do most of the work for you, having a charismatic CEO doesn't hurt either. I recommend that an investor relations professional use a hook that leaves a lasting impression. 

So what's a hook? A hook is what I consider to be a pretty effective approach to anchor your data with a memorable factoid.

For example, if you're discussing the financial metrics in your retail business, and we have a pretty big retail business within Shell, also in layman terms, right? Our gas station business. So, instead of simply presenting the most recent financials from the retail business, I would add an interesting fact that underpins or reinforces what I was trying to say.

So I, for instance, would say, "Here are the financial results of the marketing business." And did you know that we're the 23rd most valuable brand globally? According to brand finance, our brand value is 50 billion. And did you know that that's more valuable than McDonald's, Disney, or Porsche? 

This way, the PMs or analysts reflect on the meeting, and when they go back and think about the meeting they had or even share the meeting notes with the broader fund members, they'll remember, hopefully, that unique fact, and then that will actually connect them to the core of your story.

Mark Fasken: I think that's a great suggestion. I love that example too. It reminds me, I always remember these weird little factoids. There was an article that I read, this is two years ago, talking about how the Starbucks wallet, like the Starbucks card on your phone, they hold more cash for those cards than many US banks. 

Danielle Collins: Wow, see, interesting. That's interesting. 

Mark Fasken: That's just a great stat. So that's awesome. And also, I just want to go back to your comment about how taking notes isn't cool or sexy. I think it's really cool, but that's also, I'm biased because we provide a CRM product. 

I mean, I hear you because I don't know how many people, whether it's IROs or otherwise, would expect to have an effective meeting without having taken quality notes before, and having had some understanding to say this investor asked us about this in a previous meeting, or they mentioned that this was important to them. 

And so it sounds like one, you are doing a lot of really great work of organizing your notes. And you mentioned having a note template so that everything's consistent, pretty diligent about taking those notes in the meeting, and storing them somewhere so that they're reportable.

It also, though—correct me if I'm wrong—sounds like you are doing a fair amount of prep up front. And so, you know, you use an example of going to a conference, and not to put you on the spot here, but what does that process at a high level look like for your team to ensure that you and the management team are prepared for those meetings and that you are ready to be a chameleon and communicate the right story? 

Danielle Collins: And this is particularly hard at conferences because you're seeing more people, and you could have meetings that have, you know, funds from three, four different places. So it's more challenging to do it conferences versus a non-deal roadshow whereby you're actively selecting who you're meeting with. And they're usually smaller meetings. You do probably a lot more one-to-ones on non deal roadshows.

But how it works, right, is you go back into your historical notes, and we're constantly updating our notes and our approach in terms of how we should engage with that investor. So you're looking at the last notes, you’re reading the notes on what the engagement plan is. And you're like, okay, here are the top three things that we need to make sure that we address, and those top three things could constantly be changing. 

And if for some reason we weren't able to get to it in the meeting, because perhaps the meeting took a different turn, that becomes kind of running notes for you to address it the next time.

And so it's really hard to do this well, quite frankly, it takes a lot of upfront prep, but even before the meetings, right? You're quickly looking at the briefing profile or the historical context of that investor to refresh your memory.

Mark Fasken: Great. That's awesome. I think there are a lot of IROs that should be following that process. Many we see that do an amazing job of it, but I know it's always tough given the amount of time available. 

Regional Differences in Investor Relations

Mark Fasken: So I want to switch gears a little bit here and talk about investor relations and communications across different regions. Shell is a global business. Sounds like, you know, you do a fair amount of travel. Engaging with investors all over the world, Europe, U. S. 

Do you find that you have to adapt your communications much from region to region? And if so, what does that look like? 

Danielle Collins: Yeah, so, indeed, we engage with investors across quite diverse regions. So countries in Europe, Australia, parts of Asia, and of course, here in North America and Canada and the US.

And when you think about energy investment, right, they're approaching energy (the investors are), from unique perspectives shaped by their local context and global positioning. So, European investors, they will often place a stronger emphasis on governance or ESG related concerns, more broadly. So in our experience, we would encounter those more detailed ESG questions in the EU versus in North America.

Additionally, they're more likely to have a member of the ESG team or the governance team attend the meetings with the equity teams, or they'll even request individual ESG meetings outside of the equity meetings, which is really quite uncommon in North America, not to say it doesn't happen, but it's quite more uncommon.

Now with that being said, we get ESG questions all the time. They rise globally, but the frequency and the depth of these increases really varies. North American investors tend to focus more on returns when discussing ESG, whereas European investors delve into very detailed specific governance issues or labor practices, you know, what we're doing to invest in local talent, our detailed commitments to the energy transition, all of those types of things.

So knowing this, we actually approach each meeting with tailored expectations, right? So it comes back to that IR chameleon. And the regional nuances means that we often need to flex different knowledge muscles, I call them. So depending on the audience, we need to ensure we're prepared for the specific interests and expectations of that investor group.

And so I will tell you that my ESG muscles, while they exist, because I mainly work with North American investors. My ESG muscles exist, but I would say my European colleagues are the equivalent of the ESG bodybuilder, and I might have your standard couch potato ESG muscles.

So I always tell people IR is like school, right?

You're constantly studying and you're constantly preparing for these meetings. And yes, 85 percent of the questions in a given quarter are similar and you're prepared for them and you're good to go, it's the 15% that will always get you, and you're like, “Oh crap, you know what, I've got an undertrained muscle here that I probably need to work out a little bit.” And oftentimes I find myself in these really detailed ESG questions.

That's when I'm like, okay, I need to go back to the gym.

Mark Fasken: So also for anybody who's listening, you may have already realized that Danielle loves a good analogy for storytelling. Which, I mean, so do I. I love a good analogy too. And so it is so helpful in storytelling, and I'm realizing that you are just naturally good at that.

And it's funny because I'm sure that it shows up in the way that you speak with investors as well. But yeah, that's a great answer. And just to summarize, it sounds like the ESG portion of European marketing is a big thing, and we've heard that from a few guests. And again, it just comes back to making sure that you're prepared, making sure that you have the right people in the room. And, you know, if you can't answer the questions, you have people on your team that you can lean on. 

Danielle Collins: And that's really important because you can't be in theory, right? An investor relations professional should be an SME and everything, but let's face it. That's impossible. So it's really important to have someone who can answer detailed questions that, you know, you rarely get. And it's okay, by the way, to tell the investor, I don't know the answer.

Mark Fasken: And I wanted to just then maybe shift gears, come back a little bit to talking about roadshows and conferences. You know, you mentioned you do a fair amount of marketing it sounds like. How do you as a team prioritize which investors you want to engage with on roadshows, who you choose to meet with at conferences?

I think ultimately, how do you work with your brokers? It's all sort of connected. But also whether there are certain factors that you look at when you think about the investors that you want to build relationships with? 

Danielle Collins: Yeah, so IR-only meetings, right? They allow for broad engagement and they're easy because IR is my job.

So I have a lot of flexibility and how I plan my time. If we're talking about an EC member who's joining you for a roadshow or a conference, it's pretty critical for effective management of time and resources. That's fundamental and key, especially if you have an EC member traveling from another country or time zone.

So for us, our EC is located in Europe. So the ask is not, "Hey, can you do a one day non deal roadshow or a conference with me?" The ask is, "Hey, can you do a one day roadshow and conference with me? And by the way, you need to travel seven hours each way. So I need at least two days from you with travel, and you're probably going to have to travel overnight. And you're going to travel overnight, and then do a full day of meetings. And you're probably going to have to do a dinner that night and then get up and go home the next day." 

So it is really critical when EC members are involved that you need a very carefully planned schedule and you have confidence that this schedule is going to strengthen existing support and potential growth in the stock. You've really got to get the return on investment.

And so for us, there are really three main factors to consider: sector alignment, investor potential, and geographic and market reach. So on the sector and alignment piece, this may seem like a really obvious one that you want to target investors who want to hold your sector. 

In energy, for example, anyone who is going to enter energy usually did so post Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Now, of course, there are always exceptions, but I always say there isn't a magic bucket of cash sitting on the sidelines waiting to invest in energy. I wish there was. So therefore it's really important to identify those funds and PMs that want to hold energy, and usually it is those that already hold energy. 

And then the investment potential. So, look, as I said earlier, IR is my job. I can be a tie kicker and I can host a broad range of meetings. EC time rather does have to be more strategic. So, for example, that means that some investors, even if they really want to meet with an EC member, if they hold a million shares, and they don't really have potential to hold anything more than that, and you're a company that has over 3 billion shares outstanding. It's going to be really hard to put that person in front of an EC member. So you would encourage those types of investors to join fireside chats and those types of opportunities in order to hear EC members speak. 

And then the 3rd one, geographic and market research. Depending on strategic objectives, we may emphasize investors in key regions, where you think you can grow or strengthen your presence. So the energy sector, the U. S. market is particularly attractive. U.S. is energy friendly, and the two largest capital markets reside in the U.S. via Nasdaq, New York Stock Exchange. So you see a lot of energy companies leaning into the U.S.

I will also say, let's not forget Canada and Australia. So these are countries that have domestic production, and you also see a willingness as a result of these companies to hold energy stocks. 

Danielle Collins: Now to the other part of the question: How do you adapt your communications to regional differences? It goes back to what we talked about earlier about being that IR chameleon, so to speak.

So knowing your investors and what's important to them, and including their thesis on ownership. And the one thing that I didn't mention earlier, now I reflect on it, is in every meeting, I suggest you end it with asking the investor for feedback on their view of your sector and company. So through these conversations, investors generally provide a lot of important insights for you, that you can leverage to help build or maintain future positions with that particular fund.

So always at the end. Last 5 minutes say thanks for all your questions before we leave, can you give us feedback on how you think this meeting went, what you think of our strategy, anything that you would like us to change? 

Mark Fasken: And do you find that you get a lot of pretty direct feedback that way, Danielle?

Danielle Collins: Absolutely. It's interesting because when I started in IR, there was a view you shouldn't ask for feedback. And this was seven years ago. You shouldn't ask for feedback in meetings, but I found actually by asking for feedback, you get that transparent view from investors, but also they feel like you're interested in hearing from them and that you value their viewpoints and perspectives.

Mark Fasken: I think that's an amazing idea. Certainly we talk to so many IROs that talk about how valuable investor feedback is, and talk to people who do perception studies and all these types of things. And this just seems like another way that’s so simple to get that real-time feedback, especially when it's fresh in an investor's mind, right?

You've just had an hour-long conversation, and they can give you feedback based on what you've talked about. So I think that's a great takeaway. 

Danielle Collins: Well, we've actually gotten to the point where we get so much feedback in the moment that we question if we need to do formal perception studies going forward.

And it's really about fostering the relationships with the investors. I was just recently on a road show with our CFO, and we're looking to grow the position with these two funds. And actually, I called them afterwards and I said, "Hey, do you have time to chat? I just want to hear, I know we talked about feedback in the moment, but we only had five minutes and there was a lot more people who joined online. Anything else you want to share with me?" 

You would not believe some of the really helpful insights that I got, not even on the stock but their views more generally on the sector and macroeconomic conditions. So don't be afraid to just pick up the phone and have a conversation with these people.

Mark Fasken: Awesome. That's great. 

Engaging with Investors on a Budget

Mark Fasken: So I wanted to switch gears a little bit because, you know, Shell being a very, very large company, and it comes with its own challenges, and its own benefits, in terms of your exposure to investors and the size of the investor base. But, you know, there's a lot of also newer and smaller companies in the energy sector.

They may not have access to some of the data and brokers and the resources that you would have access to. Any strategies that you would recommend for effective shareholder engagement on a tighter budget, how to identify, how to contact and get in front of the right investors?

Danielle Collins: Yeah, so we are fortunate to be resource-rich in this space, and I never take that for granted. So we do have the ability to contract third-party services for surveillance and targeting. And also we're often approached by companies who will offer free services in hopes of securing future business for us.

But again, like I said, I don't take that for granted, but if you don't have a budget for third party support, I think there's actually still a lot of avenues to explore. The first one is even if you don't have a budget, just still explore affordable third party options. If you go to the different providers and you talk to them about what you want in their budget, you'll see oftentimes they will provide you with competitive rates. And I think it's really helpful to do that especially if you don't have an existing targeting document, at least to help get you started. 

The other option is to leverage your sell-side support. So approach the sell side, and see if they can provide a list of potential targets. Often if you have a strong relationship with them, they may be willing to share names without expecting something in return. For example, a non-deal roadshow commitment. I've also just recently seen a few sell side who are offering free seminars where they've actually covered different regions of who they think you should target.

I've just recently seen a sell-side do one on Canada and one on U.S. West Coast targeting. Sometimes, they offer this to you for free. 

Another one is to engage with peers and network through professional bodies. So NIRI is a great place to connect with others who happen to be in your sector. And you might say, well, why would someone in your sector share their targeting list with you? And it's not really sharing a targeting list. It's just discussing who's interested in your sector. And people generally are quite free with sharing who they're meeting with, because at the end of the day, maybe you're competing for capital, but really it's your strategy and your financials that are going to win.

So as a result, I don't have a problem sharing with my colleagues in my IOC peer set who we're meeting with in general discussions. 

And then the final one, is, I often have my investors, for example, ask me if I've met with specific peers that they're aware of in another fund who is interested in our stock.

And so my advice is, that in every sector, there are these people. And I call them the movers and shakers on the buy side. And you can tell pretty quickly who these individuals are. They're super well-connected. They're present at the conferences. They're almost holding court at the conferences.

All the other buy side are surrounded around them. They're really well respected for their deep knowledge and their insights. Foster relationships with those movers and shakers, and have a conversation with them and say, "Hey, you know, who do you think I should be actively meeting with?" Because they're not going to keep it secret who else is interested in your stock. Because they actually like the fact that you respect them enough to ask them, "Hey, who do you think I'm missing out on? Who really wants to own energy", for example. So really kind of assessing your buy side landscape, and looking for those influential movers and shakers is pretty important. 

Danielle Collins: The final thing, Mark, that I'll say about this is, even if you have a third party support, IR professionals really do need to cultivate and maintain direct relationships with their investors, and actively manage their own targeting database. Too often, I see companies outsourcing this entirely.

For example, a company A wants to go to Toronto for a roadshow. They hire a third party, they show up and they leave and that's it. If you are fortunate enough to have a third party work with you on targeting, and you want to visit a particular city, you should have a really good idea of who you want to meet with the city and then you collaborate with the third party who's organizing the roadshow for you and actively discuss who the target should be, as opposed to just showing up and accepting the targets that you're provided. 

And it goes back to what I said earlier, fostering those relationships is important because you want to be the one after a meeting, or at the end of the meeting to be able to have a real conversation about feedback.

And if you outsource your targeting, it really dilutes your ability to have the relationship where you can get transparent feedback. 

Mark Fasken: Those are great. Another lesson that I'm learning from you, Danielle, is that the use of analogies is effective in storytelling, and the other one is if you don't ask, you don't get, because you've asked for feedback and you get the feedback.

You ask for introductions or ideas from investors on other folks that they, or other peers of theirs that you should be speaking to, and it sounds like that's an effective strategy and something that I'm sure some people are open to. And again, no cost, and quality information. And so I think those are great insights.

Future of AI in Investor Relations

Mark Fasken: I don't think that this podcast episode would be complete. I feel like no podcast episode is complete these days without a question on AI, the future of AI and investor relations. I think there's a lot happening with genAI. Certainly a lot of opportunity to automate some of the manual workflows of investor relations professionals.

Are you testing out AI in your daily work? Are there things that you think are going to change in the future as you think about investor relations, communications, and AI? 

Danielle Collins: I think AI will make the job a lot more streamlined, and simplify a lot of the things today that probably are more manual.

So anything from AI to analyzing quarterly calls from different companies. AI helping with press releases related to deals or quarterly results. And I know we've talked a lot about targeting and roadshows today. What I think would be great from the next generation of AI is I simply just say, "Hey, AI system, plan a non-deal roadshow to New York."

The AI would then compile a list of long-term investors with the capacity to add a specified number of shares that I've told it. It would identify recent interactions with the CEO or the CFO or whomever and pinpoint high-priority targets. The AI would then optimize the meeting schedule for geographic efficiency.

And also the fact that maybe my EC member has to travel from Europe. It would suggest the best commercial flights. And it would outline key KPIs for measuring success. And then, before each engagement, the AI would provide a concise briefing, based on, of course, the meeting notes that we've taken. It would summarize the critical points tailored to each investor.

It would outline the strategy of how I can be an IR chameleon. And then, rather than simply me manually gathering and analyzing data, it would actually deliver actual insights to senior leadership to help us evaluate every engagement's impact post it was complete. So that's kind of what I want from AI.

Are you ready for that, Mark? It's already available. 

Mark Fasken: Do you want to come work in product at Irwin? 

No, I mean, we completely agree. I think that those are perfect examples. I mean, one of the other ones that we've released actually, is what you were talking about in the briefing, right? 

Look, going across all the different meeting notes and everything that you have, and just having these quick summaries of all the meeting notes that you've had with an investor over, you know, maybe in a year or a number of years to help understand what are the key concerns, what are the topics that keep coming up.

But I totally agree. I think, as you think about targeting, outreach, list building, and transcript analysis, I mean, there are so many opportunities, but Danielle, we've taken a lot of your time, and you've shared so many good insights here. So again, I appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Danielle Collins: Absolutely. Anytime. 

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